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From: ????????????????????????
Subject: Pipes Digest #147 - July 1, 1994

		   Pipes Digest #147 - July 1, 1994
		     Circulation this issue: 407

Welcome to new members:

	Melanie			(??????????????????)
	Cory Zito		(?????????????????????)
	Kim Anderson		(????????????????????????)
	Derek L.		(????????????)
	Claude Fuhrer		(???????????????????????????)
	Damian Handzy		(??????????????????????????)
	Lou Kidder		(??????????????????????????)
	David J. Fred		(?????????????)
	Denis G. Marcin		(?????????????????????)
	Craig Lewis		(?????????????????????)
	Art Medlar		(?????????????????????)
	Eric Norber		(??????????????)
	Ira F. Stone		(?????????????????)
	Mark Landers		(???????????????????)
	Brian Hill		(????????????????????)
	Joel			(??????????????????)
	Chris Reinhart		(????????????????????????????????????)
	David Razon		(???????????????????????????????????)
	Doug Dreger		(?????????????????????????)
	Will Alexander		(??????????????????????????)
	David Paul		(????????????????????)
	David Ott		(?????????????????????)
	David C. Cook		(????????????)
	KatmanDu		(???????????????????????)
	Nick Forakis		(????????????????????????)
	Sgt. LeLand R. Barnes	(????????????????????????)
	Duane Clark		(?????????????????????)
	Tim Kalafut		(??????????????????????)
	J.E.D.			(??????????????????????????)
	Jim			(?????????????????)

Yes, it's been three weeks since the last Digest. Many things have
intervened; buying a house and moving into it, a trip to a conference,
etc. But join us now as we continue the legislative debate (which I'll
try to tone down in later issues, but I think it's important), and
hear some clubby news from Los Angeles... 

And, of course, happy Fourth of July and Canada Day to our readers in
North America! (Hope I got it right... :) Enjoy those barbecues, and
perhaps a good smoke along with the fireworks.

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	     Help Stop Prohibition -- Keep Tobacco Legal
			Call -- Write -- Vote
			Then, Smoke in Peace.

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From: Accomplished Smokers Mailing List <???????????????????????????????>
From: ??????????????????
Subject: List

For those of you who don't read the internet, or those of you who may have
missed it......

   Top Ten Reasons for Smoking

 10   Tastes good.
  9   Not as stupid as lottery tickets.
  8   Sharon Stone does it.
  7   More interesting friends.
  6   Sexy women like smoking.
  5   French inhaling.
  4   Good after sex .. during too.
  3   The Government wants you to quit.
  2   Goes good with booze.

  And the #1 reason for smoking <drum roll>

  1   Repels yuppie scum.


[ Thought this looked of general interest, so I took the liberty :) -S. ]

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From: Colin Crist <??????????????????????????>
Subject: "Vintage" cigars...

Steve et al..

A while back (and I *do* mean a while back) I posted a question
on so called "Vintage" cigars. An uncle of mine who is a big
cigar smoker had one many years ago at a business meeting (happy
days, conducting business with a cigar and a glass of port!). He
knew nothing much about what constitutes a vintage and nor
do I, I still don't know but I have finally tried one.

What I had was a Dunhill Altamiras from the "Harvest Crop 1987" and
the cigar states "Aged Cigar". My impression was very good, it was
a fairly mild cigar, which suits me fine and although it does not
state the origin of the tobacco, I reckon on Cuban for two
        1. It reminded me (a lot) of a Romeo y Julietta (yum!),
           the flavour was more even and, I suppose, mature.

        2. It cost six pounds (about 9 dollars).

If you see one, I'd reccomend giving it a try. All in all I
found it very enjoyable, sociable smoke.

I'm still interested in finding out more on Vintage Cigars though,
I still say it's a gimmick...


Colin Crist                        Intrepid Consultancy Ltd
??????????????????????????         Programmer at large !
Mobile: 0860 472677                Currently at IBJ International.
Office: 071 236 1190 x6562         1 Friday Street, London EC4M 9JA

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From: Avik Roy <????????????????????????>
Subject: The Owl Shop

The tradition of crushing clay pipes at Yale's commencement (which the Owl 
Shop used to participate in) was more elaborate at one time.  A briar pipe 
with a Yale "Y" and the class year inlaid in silver was presented to the 
class president, and was passed around for everyone to smoke.  Mr. St. 
James of the Owl Shop used to bejewel these pipes himself, and when he 
passed away the art was lost.  The Yale administration banned the practice 
in the late sixties, probably due to typical concerns about "elitism" and 
the like.

The Owl Shop cannot be the oldest tobacconist in the country, for it was 
founded in 1934.  I know of at least one tobacconist, Boston's David P. 
Ehrlich (parent of Leavitt & Pierce), which was established prior to 
that time (in 1868, to be exact).

--Avik Roy

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From: ???????????????? (Jeff Lowell)
Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994

Re: Proposed Smoking Legislation

This isn't going to be popular, but that's never stopped me before... ;)

I've been smoking cigars and pipes since I was sixteen, and I've got to say
that I'm in favor of this legislation.  If the people around me when I'm in
public don't want to breath my smoke, then I think they have that right.  I
know that I don't want to breath anyone else's cigarette smoke, or even
cheap cigar smoke.  (Good cigars are an entirely different matter, of

Some of this might be due to the fact that I'm in California, so year
'round I have the option of stepping outside to enjoy my pipe/cigar...

If smoking was as non-intrusive as chewing gum, then I'd think this is
outrageous.  It's not.  If they were coming into my house and telling me
what to do, I'd be offended, but they're not.

So... count me as the minority of the minority, I guess.


*        Just send your e-mail to          *
*      ????????????????, and by some       *
*  rigorous combination of faith, machine  *
*      and credit card, Jeff Lowell        *
*               will get it.               *

[ Jeff and I had a few mail messages back and forth on this, which I
won't repeat here. My general argument was that the rights of
nonsmokers do not extend to denying us any place at all to smoke.
Other comments? -S. ]

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From: ????????????????????????
Subject: Nat Sherman's

I am not impressed with Nat Sherman's. The salespeople dress well, the decor 
is impressive, the space dignified, but they have a poor stock of pipes and 
tinned tobacco, and they don't know anything about pipes. The best stocked 
store with the most knowledgable personnel in NYC is De La Concha on 6th 
Ave. and 55th St. Barclay-Rex (70 E. 42nd and 7 Maiden Lane) is also good, 
although the salespeople are not as well-informed. Barclay-Rex still has 
tins of their English made-to-order Virginia Flake. This is a very good 
basic flake, which is, needless to say, no longer manufactured. These tins 
are years old and sell for $4 each (50 grams).

-Stephen Slottow

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From: ???????????????
Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994

just a quick nod to mkorchin _ try Pindar ( a long island winery ).

[ Sorry, but mkorchin's been unreachable for the past couple of
issues, and I've had to drop him. I'll reinstate him if anyone has an
address that works. -S. ]

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From: ???????????????????????????????????
Subject: Pipes

I recently began to subscribe to the digest and though maybe an 
introduction was in order.  My name is Gideon Pollach and I am a student 
at Trinity College in Hartford CT. I recently started smoking 
pipes,through the encouragement o a friend, also a digest subscriber, and 
I have a question.  How neccesary is the pre-treatment of the pipe?  I 
have read agreat deal but always manage to forget it when I start to 
break in a new pipe.  If this is neccesary is there any remedy for the 
damage done to my pipes?  

I would appreciate any knowledgeable responses.  Thanks

[ Breaking in? Depends on the pipe. The pre-carbonized ones supposedly
need no break-in, though I've found that even so it's 3-4 bowls before
they smoke right. -S. ]

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From: ??????????????????
Subject: Re: Pipes Digest

I am listening since about five issues and realized that there seems to
be a tradition that people introduce themselves. Well, briefly, I am 33
and smoking pipes (with interruptions) since I was 17. Besides this I
enjoy good cigars, my favorites are Partagas and Romeo y Julietta. (I
tried several other, non-Cuban brands but, none of them convinced me.)

As to the development of anti-smoking initiatives in the states, it
might be interesting for you to know about the situation here in Europe:

Historically, the issue rised already in the mid-17th century:

[Some examples from a booklet I came across]

	1624: Pope Urban VIII banned smoking from the churches in Sevilla
	1634: Smoking was banned in Russia
	1650: Smoking ban in Peter's church in Rome (by pope Innozenz X)
	1653: Bavaria restricted selling tobacco to pharmacies  

Currently, all countries except Britain and the Scandinavian countries
are still quite relaxed wrt smoking. (France also has strict anti-
smoking laws, but nobody is taking them very seriously). The more south
you get, the less fuss people make about it. Here in Germany it is still
not a big issue -- I do not know of any non-smoking pub, for instance.
However, the situation might get worse, as what goes on in the states
seems to move over to Europe with a delay of 2 or 3 years. We will see...

So much to this; finally, I've got three questions:

I am supposed to spend a couple of days in Charlotte, NC; is
there any pipe shop worth visiting?

Out of curiosity: What is the approximate price of Middleton's Black
& Mild in the US? I smoke it occasionally and for a puch I pay here
the equivalent of about 10 USD.

I would like to browse through the back issues of the pipes digest,
is there a way to get them (eg by ftp)? 


Joachim Posegga
Universit"at Karlsruhe
Institut f"ur Logik, Komplexit"at und Deduktionssysteme
Am Fasanengarten 5, 76128 Karlsruhe, FRG

[ Thanks for the history, Joachim! Yes, there have been antismoking
movements throughout history... but they each would have succeeded if
they had not been resisted. -S. ]

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From: ???????????????? (Jeff Lowell)
Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994

Hi, Steve:

First off, great list.  Now to the controversial stuff. ;)

>But the proposal goes farther than that. It also says that you can't
>go to _any_ indoor place and light up. You couldn't even run a private
>club for smokers only. You couldn't light a cigar at your own wedding,
>even if you rented the hall. Use a lighter, go to jail.
>I think this clearly violates the First Amendment right to peaceful
>assembly for legal purposes.

I agree that you should be able to open a club for smokers, and hire
employees who realize that they'll be around smoke, and agree to it.  But
if you're just renting out a place for a night (wedding, etc), then you're
asking that the employees of the place all have to be exposed to smoke,
whether they like it or not.  If you make lead paint, you can tell
employees that part of the job is being exposed to it, but you don't have
the right to go paint any room that you rent, to use a clumsy analogy.

>I'm all in favor of nonsmokers having places where no one smokes. I'd
>even be in favor of that being the default. But I'm adamantly opposed
>to it being a universal rule.

I think the point I'm trying to make is that smokers risk the health of
other people.  (I think with recent secondhand smoke studies, this is not
too much of a debatable fact.)  Even if they're not risking the health,
certain people simply don't enjoy inhaling other people's smoke.  (Count me
as one of those, when it comes to cigarettes.)  So _smokers_ are the ones
who infringe on the non-smokers rights when they're put together.  I think
I'm on the other side of it as you:  I'm all in favor of smokers having
places where everyone smokes.  But when you're in a place where you share
the air, the non-smoker has to win out.

Just the opinion of one smoker. ;)


*        Just send your e-mail to          *
*      ????????????????, and by some       *
*  rigorous combination of faith, machine  *
*      and credit card, Jeff Lowell        *
*               will get it.               *

[ OTOH, many researchers think the smoke studies are highly suspect at
best, and blatant axe-grinding probably. There has been much
discussion about this on alt.smokers.

I'd concede that the employees should be free to seek employment in
establishments that never allow smoking. Of which there are plenty.
Likewise, patrons should be free to rent halls where smoking is
allowed. Let the employment market, as well as the patron market,

Re clubs for smokers go, see Duane Clark's article on the LA cigar
restaurant/bar. I think it would be illegal under the proposed
legislation. -S. ]

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From: ??????????????????
Subject: Moderated newsgroup.....

   I just read the first Digest that you sent.  Here are a couple of items
you may post or file.......
1)  Levin pipes, Int'l. - With the passing of Berry Levin, the business is
going through some changes.  They are as follows:  Kathy Levin (widdow) has
moved the business to 6113 Abbey Rd. - Aptos, CA  95003 (408) 477-0140.
Nikos Levin (son) opperates NML Pipes Dirrect - P.O. Box 1393 Burlington, VT
 05402 (802) 863-1379.
Kathy is specializing in the Specialty Tobacco portion of the business while
Nikos is concentrating on all aspects of the briar (new & estate).  Highly
2)  General, personal items - I am pushing 40 and have owned pipes for 20
years (regularly smoked for about 10 yrs.).  I have a number of pieces, in my
collection, but am now almost exclusivly interested in XXXL traditional
shapes (hense the name Giantbriar).  I am searching (aren't we all), for the
perfect tobacco.  To date, I can only say that the quest has centered within
the 'English' family.
I am also interested in talking to anyone who can make display racks
(inexpensivly) for my XXXL pipes.
3) In the hobby section of America Online there is a pipe and cigar forum.
 You might post your Digest notice there.

Happy Puffing........

[ Thanks, Joel, and welcome! -S. ]

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From: "Bruce E. Gillespie" <??????????????????>
Subject: None

Steve,  Thanks for adding me to the pipes mailgroup list.  
I am 50 years old and have smoked pipes since 20 or so.  I 
am a modest smoker--only a bowl or two per day--and my 
preference in tobacco is English type blends such as 
Dunhill #965, London Mixture, Balkan Sobrannie Black or 
Gray, and especially Connoisseur's Turkish Black.  I highly 
recommend the mixtures at Connoisseur, Ltd. in NYC.  They 
are expensive, but the best I've smoked.  I have a 
collection of 100 or so pipes among which my favorites are 
Dunhills and Charatans.

Although I rotate my pipes smoking each about five 
consecutive bowls, I have found that if I break in a new 
pipe smoking it about 3 to 4 dozen bowls one-half full or 
less I build up a nice carbon layer in the hell and avoid 
the wet, unpleasant smoke that so often happens during the 
last half of the pipe.  My pipes smoke to the bottom of the 
bowl leaving only a few ashes, not the wet gunk so many 
pipe smokers experience.

If possible, please send me all the past digests.  I will 
have a new internet address on July 1, 1994:  
????????????????????  Please send the digests to PSILink if 
before the end of June.  If later, please send them to 

Thanks.  I look forward to lots of good info.   Bruce

[ Digests 1-146 sent. Happy reading! -S. ]

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From: David Ott <?????????????????????>
Subject: None


Thanks for the intro package from the pipes mailgroup - I've dealt with 
about a half dozen of the pipe/tobacco retailers on your extensive list.  
I am primarily a cigar smoker and order most of my cigars from the Famous 
Smoke Shop in NYC.  I am also a woodworker and would like to build a nice 
humidor to hold 2-3 boxes of cigars, but have not been able to find plans 
or obtain suggestions after sending letters to several of the wood 
working magazines that I receive.  In the NY and Chicago shops the going 
prices for a small humidor often exceeds $500.  I would appreciate any 
comments from you or your subscribers regarding humidor plans or 
retailers that might have well made humidors that sell for several 
hundred dollars or less.  Thanks.

					Dave Ott

[ From time to time there are discussions in rec.woodworking about
humidor plans... I'd think it's just a tight box. Others? -S. ]

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From: ?????????????????????
Subject: LA's Proposed "Premiere Cigar Haven"

LA's Proposed "Premier Cigar Haven"

Seventy Seventy Partners is a pre-formation California limited
partnership planned to develop, own, and operate a restaurant and bar
in the metropolitan Los Angeles area.  The distinct and significant
feature of the restaurant will be its dedication to the enjoyment
of premium cigars by patrons at the premises.  The restaurant will
be designed to have a traditional club-like atmosphere, and will
serve simply prepared grill items along with contemporary fare.  Along
with fine cigars, the restaurant will feature premium beverages,
including single malt scotches and rare ports.

The restaurant will have an appearance and ambiance reminiscent of
the classic east coast restaurants and clubs created in the 1930's
and 1940's.  A large separate bar and salon area will be capable of
holding approximately 50 people and is expected to serve as an
independent destination place for patrons.

The restaurant will also contain a large walk-in humidor to maintain
the ideal temperature and humidity for cigars stored at the premises.
The humidor will include a wide variety of premium cigars.  Patrons
may purchase individual cigars to be smoked at the restaurant, and
individual and quantity packaged cigars for retail take-out.  Because
of the particular orientation of the restaurant, it is anticipated
that it will become a retail destination for cigar purchasers as well.  
A special section within the humidor will be provided for locked 
cigar safedeposit boxes that will be leased to patrons for the 
storage of their personal cigars.

A trained staff will be capable of making knowledgeable cigar suggestions
in the tradition of a skilled wine sommelier.

Sound interesting?  Let me know, fellow aficionados

[ Cribbed from alt.smokers.cigars. Sounds good to me! -S. ]

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From: "Kameran Kashani" <????????????????????????>
Subject: Re: bouncy bouncy bouncy...

[ Personal message to the moderator deleted. -S. ]

Clay pipes ...

I got to thinking (dangerous, I know) that it might
be fun to try my hand at making a clay pipe or two.
My mother (an ex-art teacher) taught me the basics of
working with clay, and I've done a few simple things
in the past. There is a pottery guild here in Santa Cruz
where I can get things fired, so I think I have a good
shot at success.

Has on this list ever made a clay pipe? I've done a catalog
search of our local university library and have some leads on
books, but if anyone knows of any books that cover making
clay pipes in particular that would be helpful.


Kam Kashani

"Is it true that you have sold your soul? I say 'hey man, I don't know.
Lend me a quarter, won't you call my accountant.'" - Cracker

????????????		       (SGI Internal URL http://entropy.wpd.sgi.com)

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From: ?????????????????
Subject: Pipe Collector

Hi>  I have hundreds of pipes (mostly through Barry) and collect tobacco as
well.  Love the hobby!!!  I'm not to famaliar with the Internet so am just
sending out this feeler to see what happens.

[ This is what happens, Jim! Welcome! -S. ]

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		       Today's Snappy Comeback:

"Let me know if there's anything _you_ enjoy. I'll come around and ask
_you_ to stop."  

				- From "101 Ways to Answer the
				  Question, 'Would You Please Put Out
				  that #(!&*!$ Cigar'," Hague et. al.,

 U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ U/~ | ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U ~\U
 )				       *   *                                 ( 
( Pipe smokers will rule the world!      *      Internet Pipes Mailgroup      )
 ) (if they don't run out of matches...) *  (for all who enjoy fine tobacco) ( 
(					 *        			      )
 )           Steve Masticola, moderator  *  (????????????????????????)       ( 
(				       *   *				      )
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Article Index

  1. Subject: Pipes Digest #147 - July 1, 1994
  2. Subject: List
  3. Subject: "Vintage" cigars...
  4. Subject: The Owl Shop
  5. Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994
  6. Subject: Nat Sherman's
  7. Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994
  8. Subject: Pipes
  9. Subject: Re: Pipes Digest
  10. Subject: Re: Pipes Digest #146 - June 9, 1994
  11. Subject: Moderated newsgroup.....
  12. Subject: None
  13. Subject: None
  14. Subject: LA's Proposed "Premiere Cigar Haven"
  15. Subject: Re: bouncy bouncy bouncy...
  16. Subject: Pipe Collector
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